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[SOLVED] MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
01-18-2010, 09:39 PM
Post: #46
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
(01-18-2010 07:49 PM)michaelr64 Wrote:  Werner this is great news.
Will this patch fix the hanging of the cec-line or also enable us to control the pch from the tv(or other way around) , as was advertised by pch originally.

I missed that advert.... please enlighten me...


PCH-A100/A210/C200/A400 500GB EXT3 HDD<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Onkyo TX-NR1010<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Panasonic TX-P46S10 + 6 Bowers & Wilkins speakers.
10 NTFS 2TB USB drives on 3 hubs attached to the A400, 2 Seagate blackarmour NAS 3TB, 2 Seagate Central NAS 4TB.


The inability to setup and configure the NMT should not be disguised as a defect of the box...
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01-18-2010, 10:18 PM
Post: #47
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
(01-18-2010 09:39 PM)Willem53 Wrote:  I missed that advert.... please enlighten me...

Your wish is my command.....
see popcornhour website : http://bit.ly/5DhYZS
If pch just meant "hdmi and we will not do anything with the cec line" surely there is no need to specify cec.
Although not extensively explained i, and probably others too, will assume it will do at least the basic cec stuff as the pch and/or the pch going to standby / on-off.


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01-19-2010, 07:39 AM
Post: #48
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
(01-18-2010 10:18 PM)michaelr64 Wrote:  Your wish is my command.....
see popcornhour website : http://bit.ly/5DhYZS
If pch just meant "hdmi and we will not do anything with the cec line" surely there is no need to specify cec.
Although not extensively explained i, and probably others too, will assume it will do at least the basic cec stuff as the pch and/or the pch going to standby / on-off.


though you meant that.... CEC compliance does not guarantee cross-vendor compatibility just that if they communicate over HDMI they would do it with that protocol....
The advert did not say it would enable us to control the pch from the tv(or other way around).

Anynet (Samsung); Aquos Link (Sharp); BRAVIA Sync (Sony); HDMI-CEC (Hitachi); Kuro Link (Pioneer); CE-Link and Regza Link (Toshiba); RIHD (Onkyo); SimpLink (LG); VIERA Link (Panasonic) are some that use CEC to control devices.
Any users with two of these devices on HDMI and able to "control" one with the other? or is it just working for the devices from the same vendor...?

What I do see when starting a movie on the C200 is my Onkyo switching audio modes on the Display that are not always what I would expect based on the MediaInfo data I see... I dont know if this is CEC....

Well for now I'm happy that a patch is provided that will allow the C200 to co-exist with other CEC enabled devices...


PCH-A100/A210/C200/A400 500GB EXT3 HDD<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Onkyo TX-NR1010<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Panasonic TX-P46S10 + 6 Bowers & Wilkins speakers.
10 NTFS 2TB USB drives on 3 hubs attached to the A400, 2 Seagate blackarmour NAS 3TB, 2 Seagate Central NAS 4TB.


The inability to setup and configure the NMT should not be disguised as a defect of the box...
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01-19-2010, 04:57 PM (This post was last modified: 01-19-2010 04:59 PM by alanh.)
Post: #49
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
IMO if you list CEC in the product features bullets I would expect the device to respond to at least the protocol basics from the spec:

- One Touch Play - Allows a device to be played and become the active source with a single button press.
- System Standby - Enables the user to switch all devices to standby with one button press.
- Remote Control Pass Through - Enables remote control commands to be passed through to other devices within the system.
- Device OSD Name Transfer - Enables devices to upload their preferred OSD name to the TV. The TV can then use this name in any menus associated with that device.
- Device Power Status - Allows the current power status of a device to be discovered.

Other features defined in the spec - One Touch Record, Deck Control, Tuner Control, Device Menu Control, OSD Display, Routing Control, System Information, etc - either don't apply or are not that important.

Mainly pressing play on the C-200 should auto-switch inputs on your A/V receiver and display. System off from TV/Receiver should put C-200 in standby as well. And whatever HDMI input your C-200 is connected to on the TV & receiver should automatically detect "C-200 (1)" or some analog. If these basic features are not supported, TAKE THE CEC FEATURE BULLET OFF THE PRODUCT BRIEF UNTIL THEY ARE!
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01-19-2010, 05:45 PM
Post: #50
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
Hi alanh,
how is the interoperability between the other vendors?

I agree that the CEC feature bullet is more a ambition statement then a feature specification.. Dodgy


PCH-A100/A210/C200/A400 500GB EXT3 HDD<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Onkyo TX-NR1010<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Panasonic TX-P46S10 + 6 Bowers & Wilkins speakers.
10 NTFS 2TB USB drives on 3 hubs attached to the A400, 2 Seagate blackarmour NAS 3TB, 2 Seagate Central NAS 4TB.


The inability to setup and configure the NMT should not be disguised as a defect of the box...
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01-19-2010, 06:53 PM
Post: #51
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
(01-19-2010 05:45 PM)Willem53 Wrote:  how is the interoperability between the other vendors?

It could be tricky sometimes, but at least two features - power on/off and volume up/down - will function between units declared to use CEC, no matter who the producer is.
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01-19-2010, 07:01 PM (This post was last modified: 01-19-2010 07:02 PM by alanh.)
Post: #52
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
(01-19-2010 05:45 PM)Willem53 Wrote:  Hi alanh,
how is the interoperability between the other vendors?

I agree that the CEC feature bullet is more a ambition statement then a feature specification.. Dodgy

Can't speak much for interoperability since I don't have much to test with at work or at home that fully supports CEC. I did the implementation for our own products and the first thing I did was throw the Sigma code out the window (as with most of their stuff). But our application is limited to digital signage atm and turning the connected displays on and off from a satellite control system was our main focus.

To my knowledge, all of the vendor names you quoted are synonymous with CEC protocol defined in supplement A of the HDMI 1.3 spec (hence 1.3'a'). Vendors are free to extend the command set and I suspect most of them have. I've tested Sharp, Sony, and Samsung displays and a Sony amp and they all behaved according to the spec for the base feature set. If they didn't, they would not be able to claim HDMI 1.3a compliance.

As for as ambition statements.. I'm sure none of the C-200 customers interpreted it that way. Especially since it was a top rated feature request of the A/B series.
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01-19-2010, 07:48 PM
Post: #53
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
Two interesting link for those who want to know more..

http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/faq.aspx

http://www.videsignline.com/howto/207400...JVN?pgno=1


PCH-A100/A210/C200/A400 500GB EXT3 HDD<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Onkyo TX-NR1010<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Panasonic TX-P46S10 + 6 Bowers & Wilkins speakers.
10 NTFS 2TB USB drives on 3 hubs attached to the A400, 2 Seagate blackarmour NAS 3TB, 2 Seagate Central NAS 4TB.


The inability to setup and configure the NMT should not be disguised as a defect of the box...
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01-19-2010, 10:21 PM
Post: #54
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
I would be glad to test it for you.

I have an ONKYO 905 HDMI 1.3c receiver and a Panasonic 50V10 TV with Viera link.

ON/OFF and receiver's volume control works great when the C200 is not connected.

Yannis


(01-19-2010 07:39 AM)Willem53 Wrote:  though you meant that.... CEC compliance does not guarantee cross-vendor compatibility just that if they communicate over HDMI they would do it with that protocol....
The advert did not say it would enable us to control the pch from the tv(or other way around).

Anynet (Samsung); Aquos Link (Sharp); BRAVIA Sync (Sony); HDMI-CEC (Hitachi); Kuro Link (Pioneer); CE-Link and Regza Link (Toshiba); RIHD (Onkyo); SimpLink (LG); VIERA Link (Panasonic) are some that use CEC to control devices.
Any users with two of these devices on HDMI and able to "control" one with the other? or is it just working for the devices from the same vendor...?

What I do see when starting a movie on the C200 is my Onkyo switching audio modes on the Display that are not always what I would expect based on the MediaInfo data I see... I dont know if this is CEC....

Well for now I'm happy that a patch is provided that will allow the C200 to co-exist with other CEC enabled devices...
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01-19-2010, 10:32 PM
Post: #55
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
Willem53,

Thank you for following this issue up for all of us. How is this patch applied? Or do we have to wait until the NEXT firmware update (which could be 4-5 months). I would like to test as well.
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01-20-2010, 08:27 AM (This post was last modified: 01-20-2010 08:28 AM by Willem53.)
Post: #56
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
I think Werner is waiting on feedback of the users who asked him for the patch to test..
If you also want to test send a PM to Werner....
next FW update 4-5 months..... dont think so
C200 is the baseline model for all Frimware development for all Sigma 8643 based NMT's like Popbox and A200.
Good thing is we get all the upgrades first.... bad thing is we discover all that the beta testers missed....
C200 is the Flagship the others are either economy, dummy proof or localized versions of the C200....

Less then once a month would surprise me and it would mean that there are seriously difficult problems...
This will continue until the general perception is that the Sigma 8643 based NMT's are perfect....


PCH-A100/A210/C200/A400 500GB EXT3 HDD<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Onkyo TX-NR1010<-->HDMIv1.3<-->Panasonic TX-P46S10 + 6 Bowers & Wilkins speakers.
10 NTFS 2TB USB drives on 3 hubs attached to the A400, 2 Seagate blackarmour NAS 3TB, 2 Seagate Central NAS 4TB.


The inability to setup and configure the NMT should not be disguised as a defect of the box...
Find all posts by this user
01-20-2010, 02:58 PM
Post: #57
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
(01-12-2010 07:22 AM)Willem53 Wrote:  ... it was entered on 16th of December... no feedback on it

Is it pure coincidence that December 16 was the day on which I reported the problem via 'support' on popcornhour.com?

(01-19-2010 05:45 PM)Willem53 Wrote:  how is the interoperability between the other vendors?

My two main systems are Sony Bravia TV/HT, and both are affected by this bug.

However, I also have a Panasonic TV and CEC works perfectly well if I connect my Sony video camera to it.

If any more testers are required, I'd be very happy to try out the test firmware.
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01-20-2010, 03:10 PM (This post was last modified: 01-20-2010 03:11 PM by michaelr64.)
Post: #58
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
(01-20-2010 02:58 PM)PeterB Wrote:  Is it pure coincidence that December 16 was the day on which I reported the problem via 'support' on popcornhour.com?

yes it is a coincidence, because i reported it in the mantis system.
And i do not have any line to pch's support desk.
It was something i noticed a lot earlier in various threads, and while reading in mantis , noticed that nobody had reported it yet so i decided to report it.

No big plot here, sorry...


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01-21-2010, 08:22 AM (This post was last modified: 01-21-2010 10:03 AM by linni.)
Post: #59
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
One more thing I discovered: it kills the tuner functionality on AVR. Otherwords you cannot listen to radiostations from the receiver unless you unplug the HDMI cable from C200.
C200 --> HDMI --> Sony STR DA2400ES --> HDMI --> Sony KDL 52W4500

EDIT: removed pin 13 from HDMI cable and the tuner is back again and CEC works.
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01-21-2010, 03:19 PM
Post: #60
RE: MAJOR HDMI PROBLEM THAT WILL AFFECT YOUR OTHER COMPONENTS!!!!
I have a similiar problem that I think is CEC issue as well and I have had it since day one (I was part of the first shipment fortunately or unfortunately depending on how you look at it lol). I have Onkyo receiver. It takes 2 to 5 minutes for the receiver to see the video signal from the popcorn hour. It takes a couple hard resets to fix. I tried to use my xbox 360 after months of non-usage and it now does the same for that so I am assuming it is the CEC issue caused by the popcorn hour affecting all devices using the hdmi switch in the receiver.

I hope a fix is coming soon but I'm glad it finally is identified and I'm not the only one with the issue. At first I thought it was a bad power supply that some users were experiencing. I then thought it was not having the discrete on/off codes from the harmony one remote. I also disabled the screen saver. Wow this thing is buggy Smile Sometimes if you change the video settings from 1080p to 720p (or another video mode) using the tv mode button on the front panel of the popcorn hour I get a video signal but when I get video and change it back to 1080p I loose signal again sometimes.

My Onkyo video receiver using the hdmi 1.3a spec and my tv is a Samsung LN-T4665F.

Another note is when a movie is stopped that is using DTS Discrete ES, for example, the receiver still acts like it receiving the audio stream and still displays "Discrete ES" or whatever the audio stream is even though the movie is not playing.
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