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[A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
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11-30-2009, 03:43 PM
(This post was last modified: 12-09-2009 12:49 PM by junkcollector.)
Post: #1
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[A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
I've tried both the latest Nero Digital and Handbrake and confirmed that the AC3 pass-through audio track is not recognized by the PCH A-110. Under Info (while playing on the PCH), there is no audio information shown - just a "-". This process
Hardware: A-110 with latest FW (01-17-091022-15-POP-403-000) Video Output: Pioneer 1080i HDTV using HDMI Audio Output: Onkyo HT using Coax Network: Ethernet cable No internal HDD Demonstrated with small mp4 file created with Nero 9 Digital. MediaInfo Details: General Complete name : L:\video\ripped\Test.mp4 Format : MPEG-4 Format profile : Base Media / Version 2 Codec ID : mp42 File size : 2.49 MiB Duration : 12s 288ms Overall bit rate : 1 698 Kbps Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 14:17:42 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 14:17:53 Video ID : 1 Format : AVC Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec Format profile : Main@L3.0 Format settings, CABAC : Yes Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames Codec ID : avc1 Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding Duration : 11s 761ms Bit rate mode : Variable Bit rate : 1 367 Kbps Maximum bit rate : 2 212 Kbps Width : 720 pixels Height : 480 pixels Display aspect ratio : 16:9 Frame rate mode : Constant Frame rate : 23.976 fps Standard : NTSC Resolution : 24 bits Colorimetry : 4:2:0 Scan type : Progressive Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.165 Stream size : 1.92 MiB (77%) Language : English Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 14:17:42 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 14:17:53 Audio ID : 2 Format : AC-3 Format/Info : Audio Coding 3 Codec ID : ac-3 Duration : 12s 288ms Bit rate mode : Constant Bit rate : 384 Kbps Channel(s) : 6 channels Channel positions : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz Resolution : 16 bits Stream size : 576 KiB (23%) Title : English Language : English Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 14:17:42 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 14:17:53 Menu 00:00:00.000 : Chapter 1 MP4 fliles created with the same method prior to the Windows 7 installation show a different Audio codec in Media Info: Audio ID : 2 Format : AC-3 Format/Info : Audio Coding 3 Codec ID : sac3 Codec ID/Info : Made by Nero Duration : 1h 30mn Bit rate mode : Constant Bit rate : 384 Kbps Channel(s) : 6 channels Channel positions : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz Resolution : 16 bits Stream size : 249 MiB (16%) Title : English Language : English Encoded date : UTC 2009-10-16 00:53:49 Tagged date : UTC 2009-10-16 03:54:23 Files created prior to the upgrade continue to play fine through the PCH - just anything created with AC3 is having this problem. MP4 files with audio tracks with AAC created under Win7 play fine on the PCH. I also pointed this problem out on this post (http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showth...#pid295136), but have been unable to figure out a work-around. |
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11-30-2009, 04:22 PM
Post: #2
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
AC3 in an MP4 container has only recently become standardised and isn't yet available on any hardware player, though it has been available for more than a year and is widely used in encodes by Handbrake and Nero. I've got a feature request for this capability to be added to the PCH over here since I think it's about time.
In the meantime, the workaround is to remux the MP4 to MKV using MKVmerge or similar; this will just repackage the video and audio streams into an MKV without messing with them, and the PCH will be able to play the result fine. |
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11-30-2009, 06:08 PM
Post: #3
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
(11-30-2009 04:22 PM)peterjcat Wrote: AC3 in an MP4 container has only recently become standardised and isn't yet available on any hardware player, though it has been available for more than a year and is widely used in encodes by Handbrake and Nero.That seems odd, since for 6 months I've encoded MP4 containers with Nero with AC3 audio and they play just fine on my A-110. Only after the Win7 upgrade did this capability break. (11-30-2009 04:22 PM)peterjcat Wrote: In the meantime, the workaround is to remux the MP4 to MKV...I re-encoded a test file with Handbrake into MKV with the AC3 pass-through (on this Win7 box) and it played fine. So that seems to be an acceptable workaround. I'm still disappointed - I have to fix a bunch of MP4's and my faithful workflow is now defunct. I could re-encode in Nero's AAC for audio, but I'm told AC3 is better quality because it's a pass-through. I completely endorse your feature request of adding AC3 to MP4, especially since it was working for me (clearly the NMT can handle it - somehow my old MP4's circumvented the logic that is now preventing it). |
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11-30-2009, 06:21 PM
(This post was last modified: 11-30-2009 06:49 PM by spawn.)
Post: #4
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
The A-110 never supported AC3 in the .mp4 container, im a litle surprised you say your Nero recodes with AC3 pass through audio worked - but Im encoding one now to test.
But to my big surprise, I just created a Nero Recode mp4 with AC3 audio passthrough and tested it on my C-200 and My A-100 and both played it just fine Nero must be doing something special in the muxing since this works. It doesnt play on my HTPC with VLC or MPC, only through Nero Showtime VLC complaints about missing decoder for sac3 which is also a strange codecid, since it would normally be A_AC3 General Complete name : D:\PCHtest\Kill Bill 2.mp4 Format : MPEG-4 Format profile : Base Media / Version 2 Codec ID : mp42 File size : 74.3 MiB Duration : 7mn 44s Overall bit rate : 1 343 Kbps Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:18:57 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:22:20 Video Format : AVC Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec Format profile : Main@L3.0 Format settings, CABAC : Yes Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames Codec ID : avc1 Duration : 7mn 42s Bit rate mode : Variable Bit rate : 891 Kbps Maximum bit rate : 2 446 Kbps Width : 720 pixels Height : 428 pixels Display aspect ratio : 1.682 Frame rate mode : Constant Frame rate : 30.000 fps Resolution : 24 bits Colorimetry : 4:2:0 Scan type : Progressive Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.096 Stream size : 49.1 MiB (66%) Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:18:57 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:22:20 Audio Format : AC-3 Format/Info : Audio Coding 3 Codec ID : sac3 Codec ID/Info : Made by Nero Duration : 7mn 42s Bit rate mode : Constant Bit rate : 448 Kbps Channel(s) : 6 channels Channel positions : Front: L C R, Rear: L R, LFE Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz Resolution : 16 bits Stream size : 24.7 MiB (33%) Title : English Language : English Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:18:58 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:22:20 Text Format : VobSub Codec ID : subp Codec ID/Info : The same subtitle format used on DVDs Duration : 7mn 44s Bit rate mode : Variable Bit rate : 5 275 bps Stream size : 299 KiB (0%) Title : Danish Language : Danish Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:19:04 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 17:22:20 Quote:I could re-encode in Nero's AAC for audio No need for that, as Peter explains, the simple way is to just remux your existing mp4 with ac3 audio, into an mkv using mkvmerge, it doesnt involve any reencoding and only takes a few minuttes depending on file size. Living room: C200/A200/A100 HDMI to Pioneer KURO KRP-500A plasma / Denon AVR 3808 / KEF 5005.2 / B&W DM685 Kids room: C200/A110 HDMI to Panasonic 42PZ85, Optical to Logitech Z5500. PLEASE READ THE WIKI |
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11-30-2009, 06:58 PM
Post: #5
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
Wow, I'm surprised too. I wonder what Nero is (/was) doing that Handbrake isn't, as I've never got AC3 in MP4 from Handbrake to work on the A-110 or C-200.
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11-30-2009, 06:59 PM
(This post was last modified: 11-30-2009 07:15 PM by spawn.)
Post: #6
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
This maybe
Codec ID : sac3 ?? Handbrake use Codec ID : ac-3 General Complete name : D:\PCHtest\KilllBill2ac3.mp4 Format : MPEG-4 Format profile : Base Media / Version 2 Codec ID : mp42 File size : 81.9 MiB Duration : 10mn 35s Overall bit rate : 1 081 Kbps Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 18:07:20 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 18:09:47 Writing application : HandBrake 0.9.4 2009112300 Video Format : AVC Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec Format profile : Main@L3.0 Format settings, CABAC : Yes Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames Codec ID : avc1 Duration : 10mn 35s Bit rate mode : Variable Bit rate : 631 Kbps Width : 720 pixels Height : 428 pixels Display aspect ratio : 2.35 Frame rate mode : Constant Frame rate : 25.000 fps Resolution : 24 bits Colorimetry : 4:2:0 Scan type : Progressive Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.082 Stream size : 47.8 MiB (58%) Writing library : x264 core 79 Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=2 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x1:0x111 / me=hex / subme=6 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=0 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=0 / 8x8dct=0 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=2 / b_pyramid=0 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / wpredb=0 / wpredp=2 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40 / rc_lookahead=40 / rc=crf / mbtree=1 / crf=20.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00 Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 18:07:20 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 18:09:47 Audio Format : ac-3 Codec ID : ac-3 Duration : 10mn 35s Bit rate mode : Constant Bit rate : 448 Kbps Channel(s) : 2 channels Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz Resolution : 16 bits Stream size : 33.9 MiB (41%) Language : English Encoded date : UTC 2009-11-30 18:07:20 Tagged date : UTC 2009-11-30 18:09:47 Living room: C200/A200/A100 HDMI to Pioneer KURO KRP-500A plasma / Denon AVR 3808 / KEF 5005.2 / B&W DM685 Kids room: C200/A110 HDMI to Panasonic 42PZ85, Optical to Logitech Z5500. PLEASE READ THE WIKI |
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11-30-2009, 07:25 PM
Post: #7
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
(11-30-2009 06:21 PM)spawn Wrote: The A-110 never supported AC3 in the .mp4 container, im a litle surprised you say your Nero recodes with AC3 pass through audio worked - but Im encoding one now to test. But if you have to reencode a bunch of movies it is a PITA. Also, for me, Tivo supports mp4+ac3 well for multichannel output but it doesn't do mp4+aac or mkv well at all. I don't want to have multiple copies of the movies. |
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12-09-2009, 12:53 PM
Post: #8
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
(11-30-2009 07:25 PM)superflysocal Wrote: Also, for me, Tivo supports mp4+ac3 well for multichannel output but it doesn't do mp4+aac or mkv well at all. I don't want to have multiple copies of the movies. Handbrake lets you put in both the source AC3 as well as a converted AAC track - would an MP4 with both audio tacks work in your situation (A-110 plays the AAC and Tivo plays the AC3)? |
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12-09-2009, 01:08 PM
Post: #9
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RE: [A-110] No AC3 Playback on Pass-through Audio in MP4 created on Windows 7
That does work, except that the AAC is only stereo -- ideally you'd be able to get multichannel audio from all your devices.
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