Syabas is first to support MKV3D

[Willem53]

(03-25-2011 09:06 AM)vanluijk Wrote:  

(03-25-2011 04:49 AM)Syabas Wrote:  We intend to stay ahead in delivering the latest innovation and technology.

Sorry, but since you failed to deliver what was considered the latest technology in Sept 2009, you failed miserably in staying ahead. Please consider omitting these marketing posts and try to catch up first.

I realize you depend on factors beyond your control and I therefore normally don't complain, but this type of posts really angers me sufficiently to provoke a response. When you really manage to fix the basics I would post a very enthausiastic response to a bragging post about finally having produced a solid mainstream device!

I believe enough is said in this thread on the priority of development effort from the user perspective..... no need to repeat ourselves here..

[vanluijk]

(03-25-2011 10:40 AM)Willem53 Wrote:  I believe enough is said in this thread on the priority of development effort from the user perspective..... no need to repeat ourselves here..

Agreed. I assume the same applies to marketing posts?

[Dave_D]

(03-25-2011 10:46 AM)vanluijk Wrote:  

(03-25-2011 10:40 AM)Willem53 Wrote:  I believe enough is said in this thread on the priority of development effort from the user perspective..... no need to repeat ourselves here..

Agreed. I assume the same applies to marketing posts?

I hope not...

It's hard enough to get any Syabas people to post at all so whether it's spam or real data users find useful I just hope Syabas doesn't stop engaging with the community.

[HeartWare]

(03-25-2011 10:23 AM)Bytec Wrote:  Can anybody explain to me why 3D files are marked with special file names (*.3DSBS.* and *.3DTAB.*) instead of using Stereoscopy parameter in MKV container format?

As far as I understand it, for .MKV files it *will* use the Stereoscopy parameter in the MKV container, but in case you want to use it with .AVI files or other file types (or if the .MKV file is not muxed with a version of MKVMerge that supports this Stereoscopy parameter) you can use the file name method to tell the payer to signal your TV over HDMI 1.4 as to how it should interpret the video signal.

[Bytec]

(03-25-2011 01:47 PM)HeartWare Wrote:  

(03-25-2011 10:23 AM)Bytec Wrote:  Can anybody explain to me why 3D files are marked with special file names (*.3DSBS.* and *.3DTAB.*) instead of using Stereoscopy parameter in MKV container format?

As far as I understand it, for .MKV files it *will* use the Stereoscopy parameter in the MKV container, but in case you want to use it with .AVI files or other file types (or if the .MKV file is not muxed with a version of MKVMerge that supports this Stereoscopy parameter) you can use the file name method to tell the payer to signal your TV over HDMI 1.4 as to how it should interpret the video signal.

So I understand that both (file name and Stereoscopy) methods are/will be supported, right? That sounds reasonable. Thank you.

[HeartWare]

That is my understanding as well...

[Syabas]

Simple facts of life...

If there is no Marketing post, there is no Sales...
If there is no Sales, there is no fund for R&D...
If there is no R&D, there is no more firmware updates
If there is no more firmware updates, there is no more Popcorn Hour...

In fact, internally we felt that Popcorn Hour already does too
little Marketing effort, as compared to our competitors.

I'm not sure what are the complaints abt the "basics" here.
I thought we've already covered all the basics playback.

There will always be some issues, as there are myriads of
content out there, and there's hardly a standard way of encoding.
Some issues took longer to resolves, but that is mainly due to
limitation of the Sigma SDK. For example, the downmix of TrueHD core,
and its bitstreaming (will be fixed in next build).
But we are getting there, even if it took us more than half year to
convince Sigma to fix it.

Meanwhile, we can't wait forever until Sigma SDK is up to speed.
We do our stuff and continue to deliver other innovations we
believe is of value to majority of our users.

Oh, btw, we just released BBC iPlayer app, but it will only
be available to UK users. That is, until BBC worked out their
international business strategy.

Before anybody ask, I'll just inform that our Apps team are
a separate team, and as it is high level Flash Lite development
it does not have to wait for Sigma SDK to be patched, thus
we can deliver such innovation faster.

Therefore, delivering new features such as BBC iPlayer apps,
(or MKV3D for the matter), does not take away anything
from our continuous work on fixing bugs with the Sigma SDK.
However, such bug fixing is mostly still bounded by ability
(and willingness) of Sigma to patch their SDK.

Do continue your feedback, Werner is here most of the time
and is our eyes and ears on this forum and to his credit, he
does push strongly for many of the bug fixes request internally.

Some will get fixed quickly, some will take longer if there is
a need to patch on Sigma SDK, which we have no control over.

Thanks for your understanding.

[FLaSH]

Quote:I'm not sure what are the complaints abt the "basics" here.
I thought we've already covered all the basics playback.

An example?
Hit "PAUSE" in NMJ while playing some music

I hope this is basic enough

[accident]

I think the beta team has done a great job at documenting the problems and how to recreate them for the engineering team. You just need to actually fix some of them now..

I think something else that oculd really help is finding a way to look through the eyes of a new user to your product. Maybe some local university students who might have an interest in this for a focus study. It's frustrating to take a pch out of the box and get it to connect to your computer, the network, the tv and have it play something quickly. Every part of the player has some minor issue but makes it hard to setup and get going.

[vanluijk]

(03-26-2011 05:53 PM)Syabas Wrote:  Simple facts of life...

If there is no Marketing post, there is no Sales...
If there is no Sales, there is no fund for R&D...
If there is no R&D, there is no more firmware updates
If there is no more firmware updates, there is no more Popcorn Hour...

This sounds like 'Allow me to spread desinformation in your own interest.' I don't like to be taken hostage like that. In my line of work people get killed when following your standards. (And unfortunately you're right. Also there that happens, but it doesn't mean I lower myself to that.)
Justified bragging, that is staying with the facts, will go without reaction. The provocative type of statement that my post was a reaction to will not be left unanswered. (Note that I did not react to your first post, presting mainly facts!)

(03-26-2011 05:53 PM)Syabas Wrote:  In fact, internally we felt that Popcorn Hour already does too
little Marketing effort, as compared to our competitors.

This tells me more about the ethics of the field and Syabas in particular and does not relate to anything I said before.

(03-26-2011 05:53 PM)Syabas Wrote:  I'm not sure what are the complaints abt the "basics" here.
I thought we've already covered all the basics playback.

Lets talk a bit about the network interface that crashes for many people using Transmission even at 100Mbit connections and the Gbit connections that are not working for many people. (Yes I know the community worked out a fix that involves a bit of hacking into the machine, but that can't really be what Syabas means when talking about their 'stay ahead in delivering the latest innovation and technology' product?)

(03-26-2011 05:53 PM)Syabas Wrote:  Some issues took longer to resolves, but that is mainly due to
limitation of the Sigma SDK. For example, the downmix of TrueHD core,
and its bitstreaming (will be fixed in next build).
But we are getting there, even if it took us more than half year to
convince Sigma to fix it.

(03-26-2011 05:53 PM)Syabas Wrote:  However, such bug fixing is mostly still bounded by ability
(and willingness) of Sigma to patch their SDK.

I acknowledged this in my previous post. The fact of the matter is that it means that you're still catching up with the specs, which sounds different from what I reacted on previously. Moreover, as an end user I do not (have to) have insight in your design choices and their consequences at the time I bought the C200. The fact we have experienced these consequences justified a more humble attitude by Syabas when joining the community forum.

(03-26-2011 05:53 PM)Syabas Wrote:  Thanks for your understanding.

Don't get me wrong. You have that (and have had it for 15 months now!) as long as you stick to the facts and refrain from unjustified marketeer bragging while a more humble approach to the community would be appropriate.

---

I apoligize to the moderators for my previous post, but a discussion can stop only if it stops from two sides.
I recommend (if possible) moving all post that relate to this discussion to a new thread to prevent the present one from being taken off-topic.

[Willem53]

@vanluijk if you want to comment then first take the perspective of the Syabas company and think of the business on their level.
It is a fact that no marketing leads to no sales leads to no product... this is basic economics....
Your jump to marketing = misinformation is unsubstantiated, but even if it was it is your own intelligence whether you "believe" marketing or take it for what it is "a way bring products into a market"

The complaint about the basic faults are of course clearly documented in MANTIS where Syabas still need to give a first response to 125 reports.
I hope Syabas marketing department will take a good look at the 125 unresolved fault reports so they can understand why, even when announcing a achievement, these unresolved issues can spoil the excitement....

And finally don't underestimate the marketing power of this forum and it's community..

[vanluijk]

(03-26-2011 07:56 PM)Willem53 Wrote:  Your jump to marketing = misinformation is unsubstantiated, but even if it was it is your own intelligence whether you "believe" marketing or take it for what it is "a way bring products into a market"

@Willem53
I apoligize. Non-informative would have been a better term.
Thanks for your balanced response. I hope the thread can stay on-topic from now on.

[Syabas]

If we developed a new feature using resources that does not take away our
limited resources from bug fixing, say, the BBC iPlayer apps, should'nt we announce
it to our users ?
Likewise MKV3D is something that came by from discussion with Matroska development
team, and since there is ability of the SMP8643 to handle some HDMI1.4 signalling,
we decided to go for it.

Or should we keep such new development a secret, since this is deem a provocation, as vanluijk opines ?

Vanluijk, can you list the issues that you personally consider your pet peeve,
and I can promise you we will review it through ?


FlaSH, the Pause issue is overlooked by NMJ developers, it is already on top
priority list for next build. Note that NMJ is a work-in-progress, a new development
to bring richer UI to the NMT. If you stick to the original NMT fileplayer, all the
basics still works, we have never obsoleted the original basic functions.

NMJ is currently in phase 2 of its development, there will be more
changes coming, and possibly new issues as well. But, like they say, it may get
worse, before it gets better.

[Willem53]

Wrong approach...

never ask an outsider how you should do your business, but be aware of the perception of the outsider and his priorities if he is also your customer....
so don't keep things a secret and also start communicating how you plan to address the 125 open issues that are in MANTIS.
as to the resources not being interchangeable between development activity we are all aware of that..... but we also know the concept of development budgets and hiring developers.... and the choices made...
as a moderator of this forum I do object to the Idea that a user who rants get his "special list" at the attention of Syabas..... this forum will become a big mess when everyone is going to try that routine.. van luijk list is everyone's list and that is the test incident report application used by Syabas named MANTIS.... are you even aware of what is in there?

Here is the list, some faults are generic and some are only valid for a specific setup situation that exists with some users and some are probably at fault at some other device the user has in his setup.
but it does need sorting out and and some real attention from the Syabas test management team.

(SD) moving up/pageup from webservices with multiple pages generates an error.
AAC audio in MKV files does not work right. over hdmi
Able to fast-foward and fast-reverse during playback of an audio file
Adding Network Shares is Broken from Setup ...
After playback of appcenters streams, the browser video files start in background
After playing an avi/mkv with ac3 audio you lose mp3 audio
After Playing Revision 3 The Source Key Does NOT work Any more
Album art/info not displayed for m4a/AAC
Audio crackle when starting an ac3 track playing or streaming a DVD
Audio dropouts, mkv DD 6.1
Audio stutter in MKV's with DD+
Auto frame rate does not change to 60hz when playing 24hz files.
Avatar BD Folder Playback Bug
Avi files refuses to play
AVI with MPEG and WMA with WMApro have no sound after playing a dvdstructure.
Bad deinterlacing quality of SD DVD material
BD Menu Language Setting required.
BD-live compatability
BD-live menu zoomed 4 times.
Black screen+no sound when starting a movie (mkv) when video setting changes.
Booting C-200 with a USB drive inserted in the front causes booting to pause
Browser starts playing wrong file after standby when issued during playback
C200 freezes when FTPing lots of files to any disk attached.
C200 stuck after playing DVD (retail)
C200/A2x0 cannot deal with drives greater then 2Tb
Can't seek in .TS files that have wrapping timestamps.
Certain subtitles being displayed even when Subtitles is off
Crank 2 (BD) - Fullscreen-Advertising streams trailer from the web, trailer is positioned outside of the viewport
Default audio and subtitle language are not taken into account in BD-Lite mode
Delay when when ogg file starts to play
Disabling HDMI audio doesn't work for Youtube App after fresh boot
Disks (CD/DVD) keeps slowly spinning.
DVD (mpeg2): unable to show on TV
DVD's are not output using configured resolution, resulting in display errors
Enabling embedded subtitles in MKV container causes audio drop out and sometimes cause out of sync audio
File Mode copy does not work when source or target is a SMB Network Share
FLAC files with more than 181 characters in path/filename wont play using 'Play' button
FLAC under 25 s stuck in loop d gapless playback
Flickering green lightbars in bottom of the video
Forced primary subtitles on playback of all single vob files
Frame Drops / jumpy playback of ts-files
Framerate for M2TS files with TrueHD tracks not detected/displayed
Front LCD show %20 instead of a space of a WebService name
FTP reports Invalid cross-device link with 2 internal drives
FTP server can not resume files > 2Gb
Gapless playback FLAC files not 100% anymore
Gapless playback is no longer sample accurate from Firmware 02-03-100531-21-POP-408 Beta 1 (wav files)
GUI behaviour starting/stopping NMT Applications
HDMI problem after rebooting C200
HDMI protocol does not detect and send the correct number of channels of LPCM BD (folder) played (send 7 chanels inst. of 5)
Incorrect Aspect Ration for Photos on 4:3 displays
Incorrect timeline for Blurays using seamless branching
INFO button when playing back single M2TS files shows inaccurate statistics.
Info overlay flashes on some pictures, overlay is incomplete
Installing NMTapps on usb
ISO DVD rips play back as 4:3 on a 16:9 display
Jerky video on mkv playback (25fps)
Language settings going away when playing a DVD ISO
LCD nagivation not possible when an alert pop-up appears (e.g. connection failed to samba)
LFE output in bitstream-mode too high?
Loud POP sound over the audio when starting/pausing/resuming video
Menues on some retail BDs extremely slow
Micro DVD .sub without fps specification in subtitle file go out of sync
MKV with S_VOBSUB and Chapters crash the C200
MP3 and FLAC audio decoding broken after playing DVD/BD real or ISO at DTS or Dolby Digital
mp4 playback does not work on some files that play on 100 series
MPEG4 video files with MPEG1 Audio in an AVI container bitrate info frozen when you press the info button
Multichannel .WAV files report the incorrect time length.
Need to switch between languages to get sound (2 Lang MKV file)
Network performance issue affecting audio playback at high bitrates.
New feature issue: 3D auto-switch does not work if there is any "." in the file name
NFS using UDP not working with Ethernet Configuration set to Auto on Gigabit LAN.
No Audio in PIP
No Audio Mute or Volume Change
No MPEG sound after playing Dolby Digital sound track
No sound from internet radio or Shoutcast after Blu-Ray playback with DTS sound
No sound with You Tube through receiver over SPdif
No timeline displayed and song length with AAC
No TrueHD from SMB streaming a BD iso file
No video output playing/streaming VIDEO_TS folder after MKV selecting subtitle and audio track
No voice in mkv playback with DD5.1
Optical DVD/BD drive doesn't spin down.
Page Up/Down in RobG Apps Changes Volume Instead Of Paging
Pause icon stays visible even though movie is playing again
PGS Subtitle duration is wrong.
PGS Subtitles in MKV timing issues
Photobucket never works again after putting in A user name
Playback of Avatar Retail BluRay Disc
Playing certain BDAV (m2ts) files shows the wrong playback length, and has crashed once
Playing data files from VCD/SVCD
Playing movie and turning on Subtitles with undetermined languages (blank) results in C-200 Crash
Plugin USB stick kicks out previous USB HDD from order
Problems with playback of 96k WAV files
req: Rewind for M2TS.
Resume no Longer works for Http streams.
SAMBA service does not share all drives on C200
Screen blanking when in menu system at 1080i 60hz
Screensaver activates during playback of Internet Media (NextNewNetworks and Malaysiakini.tv)
Shoutcast after selecting a radio station the app takes long time to play the selected station
Simple BD view cannot handle branching BD's
SimpleBD and SimpleBD+AVCHD disregards subtitle language selection in Setup
Spaces coverted to %20 in Title
SPDIF/COAX still high in stand-by
Spinning Circle display superimposed over BD Loading
Srt subs with m2ts files are not working anymore
SUBTITLE Arabic Tashkeel character shaping issue
Subtitles glow (red, green, blue) when selecting sub playing a DVD.
Subtitles issues
Subtitles not displayed after a resume
Subtitles out of sync when resume an mkv file
Sync and video control OSD placement
Sync and video control osd time
Time Server Broken on the Newest Beta FW, 02-02-100127-19-POP-408-Beta1
Update of NZBget + NZBget webinterface
USB drives attached to C200 get lost when coming out of sleep/screensaver
USB path assignment and USB sharing over network
Video outputsetting AUTO always changes back to 1080P 60hz
Video_ts/DVD ISO not returning to menu at end of film
VOB files framerate sync not working
White ring of death
wmapro: passthrough misses the center audio on HDMI (to tv)
WMV files won't play after watching a DVD (retail)
Youtube audio does not work via coaxial/optical - HDMI not affected
reopened
1080i video through matrix switch jumps to 480i, then to nothing then back, then to blank
Audio dropouts with Pass Through using DTS-HD & Dolby True HD
Pausing BD optical disk playback loops sound
Regressions in the SSA engine

[Dave_D]

Wow... that's a lot

I see 5 reports there I'm tracking he he he.