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Syabas is first to support MKV3D
03-29-2011, 04:50 PM (This post was last modified: 03-29-2011 05:07 PM by accident.)
Post: #76
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
(03-29-2011 07:33 AM)Syabas Wrote:  Typically what we consider critical are:
1. crash, hang
2. broken playback or features
3. reliability issues, like flash corruption, etc

Those issue that can be workaround or just an inconvenience to users
we will put it as medium priority.

I would like to offer consideration for what I would call blocking features be added to critical. these are features that block a new user from successfully using the unit with minimal tech knowledge.

For example (without trying to preach my particular pet peeves):
Samba shares to a modern security patched mac or windows machine and the unstable network stack settings. From your description these would end up as medium but to be they are blocking as you need to know how to deal with these and impact almost every user. 1 of them is fixable via a csi app so what you need to tweak in the firmware settings is figured out for you. The other is updating samba as everyone else has done the last couple weeks.

Quote:I can understand the frustration of users who only experience the issue
on their setup. However, our QA works with limited number of setup,
which may or may not capture the same issues. If it is not reproducible,
then the chances of fixing it becomes rather slim. I'll get QA to contact
the beta-testers directly on such issues.

This is a good start but it sounds like you need to expand your dev lab as well to be able to handle the vast array of setups your users are seeing. You can use the beta team to look for regression problems but you need to find ways to reproduce them.


I'm well aware of the extra ability just a minor chip update like 1 step to the opengl es cores would give to the units so I agree as sigma whirls down support for these chipsets, it's wise to get started on the next one. I also am very aware of content deals and what they want in the units to protect their media so I understand the need to move forward...

My frustration to date has been what appears to be ignoring the very basics. Even before playing there are basics needed just to get to the media file. I also put the new app api and gaya into the basics. It will influence if I even consider your next model because I'm not compromising my home computer security because you aren't updating underlying technology to keep up with industry changes.

Thank you for taking the time to engage us with this threads, it is very appreciated.
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03-29-2011, 05:07 PM (This post was last modified: 03-29-2011 05:59 PM by Pain.)
Post: #77
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
Since this might be the last chance to influence priorities I also want to give my point of view.

The top 3 reasons why people posts questions on this board (maybe not correct but this is my opinion)

1. Network issues. Stability, Compatibility and Setting up (like accident says).

2. HDMI related problems.
People have black screens, video dropouts, flickering. Often only at 1080p60/50Hz.
The usual advice we can give is to try another HDMI cable, but some people, mostly C200 owners can't get it to work anyway.

3. Problems playing certain types of files unless the A/C200 is rebooted first.
I can only assume that the player code doesn't properly cleanup after/before playing media. This should not be too hard to fix.
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03-30-2011, 12:47 AM
Post: #78
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
Regarding 3D mkv, I am still curious about the "first" claim, is it because you use the hdmi 1.4 protocol? I tested some 3d sbs mkv files with the pop box (my c200/a200 is not connected to my 3d tv), and it worked as expected, auto switching my panny tv to 3d mode. I then decided to test the same 3d mkvs with the dune. I was also able to play back on my panny tv, the only difference is I had to manually switch my tv to 3d mode. So is the fact that the pch/pop box can autoswitch the tv mode what makes it the first? Thanks

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03-30-2011, 12:55 AM (This post was last modified: 03-30-2011 12:56 AM by accident.)
Post: #79
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
I think it's word play on being the first to support the 3d header extensions added to the mkv format so a player could detect it was a 3d video stream, and in this case also switch the tv mode for you. 3D video is nothing special encoding wise so anything that can play video in an mkv container can play the video. From what I understand in this thread, it was the mkv guys that contacted them to develop and work on this extension to mkv which I like. It wasn't another lets add it and scramble from the embedded player makers to figure out if/how to support it.
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03-30-2011, 04:32 AM (This post was last modified: 03-30-2011 05:26 AM by Syabas.)
Post: #80
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
dbone,

We worked closely with Matroska developers and the MKVToolnix developers
to get proper support of MKV3D stereoscopic field. Initially there is some
discrepancies between MKV specification and the values generated by
the MKVToolnix, which were resolved after discussion with them.
MKVToolnix 4.5.0 onwards have this patch.

Matroska issued a PR to this effect:
http://matroska.net/news/popcorn-3d.html

Besides compliance with Matroska specification, we need to develop
HDMI1.4 protocol signalling as well, to signal your 3DTV to switch
to side-by-side or top-and-bottom mode.
This is what being claimed in the PR here.

A little bit more information. Matroska specification actually calls for
MKV3D files to be labeled *.mk3d although *.mkv works fine.

To extend this auto-signalling support beyond MKV, we decided to
specify the naming *.3DSBS.* and *.3DTAB.* to other formats such
as *.TS, *.AVI, so that we can determine which 3D format it is in
and signal the 3DTV accordingly.
This is because these format does not carry a Stereoscopic mode field.

I personally uses a Panasonic 3DTV as well, and you know that going
through its menu to switch the 3D mode and back (when coming back
to 2D UI), is a pain. Hope this little feature helps.


accident,

When we first decided to restructure our platform, moving away from legacy browser
to Flash Lite based, we already had in mind to make it an open platform to allow
3rd party developers to add their interpretation of the UI, or their implementation of
the metadata scanner to the NMJ platform.
Only thing we needed control over is the database schema (otherwise it will be
a havoc) and also the API implementation.

We have made our database schema and the command server APIs available to
developers for this purpose.

Please PM me, and I'll get you in touch with our developers, so that
you can provide your inputs on the APIs required or any issues on the API.
Do bear in mind our developers are rather busy as well, however, I'll ensure
that they communicate with the community developers in a prompt manner.

Regarding some of the patches that is already available via CSI, we are very
aware of it (Werner is making sure we do), some fixes like the network issue
via the LTU package will be incorporated in next build which is already on our
QA queue.

As for the Samba fixes, this will have to wait till the build after the next.

Finally, we thank the community developer for contributing various patches
via the CSI. Sorry for being slow to incorporate some of the patches due
to manpower constraint, but we will eventually add them.


accident,

Just want to add that the same command server APIs and database schema
will be carried forward to next generation platform.
This is to ease migration of 3rd party apps to new platform.
Let us know anything else needed by the community developers.
(03-29-2011 01:42 PM)HeartWare Wrote:  Personally, I also have very few outstanding problems (not that there aren't any - they just are in areas I don't use).

My main wish for the new version is a good PGS subtitle support (both 1080p and 720p and both playing on 1080p and 720p video, ie. playing a 720p PGS subtitle on 1080p video should have the subs scaled up, and playing 1080p subs on a 720p video should have the subs scaled down - or the video scaled up).

One other thing would be support for 720p/1080p VOBSUB subtitles. Why, you ask? Because there are TVs out there that supports playback of MKV files with embedded VOBSUBs, but they don't scale 480p/576p to 720p/1080p when playing back, but works fine with 720p/1080p VOBSUBs.

So in order for the files I make myself of my BluRays (in 720p) to be playable on my C-200 and the aforementioned TV, I have to include both 576p and 720p VOBSUBs in the file. It would be very nice to be able to only include 720p VOBSUB in the file.

Thanks for the feedback, let me run it through engineering before I get back to you.

Sales: sales@syabas.com
Tech support: support@syabas.com
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03-30-2011, 06:43 AM (This post was last modified: 03-30-2011 06:46 AM by deh2k7.)
Post: #81
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
I would also like to add that it's important to look at feature requests that have a lot of the user's attention. Bug fixes are top priority of course, but the whole reason to have a platform such as the C-200 is extensibility.

We've been told to create feature requests and if they get enough support, they will get the attention of Syabas. Currently, these requests get little to no commentary from Syabas on whether they are feasible, likely to happen or otherwise. Like with the lack of QA comments on MANTIS, this engenders a sense of apathy from the community.

I'm very pleased, however, to see a good dialog in this thread, and would encourage Syabas to participate more regularly in the feature requests section.

A good example is this thread, which has more responses to the poll than any other feature request:
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showth...?tid=42667

It revolves around native resolution output (automatically) of video files - vs. specifying a fixed resolution output all of the time. Many users have scalers that are superior to what is in the C200, especially for SD material. This is also related to at least one MANTIS report on poor SD upscaling quality. This is a capability found in many consumer video source devices - it's very much an important feature for us. Many of us would consider this a core usability/functionality that should be in the product already. Even a basic ability to allow resolution switching on the fly while video is playing would be an improvement. Other than a couple vague comments from Werner, there has been no dialog or discussion with the community. Perhaps its feasible. Perhaps it's a limitation of the Sigma SDK or chip itself. Information would be good - if it's a limitation, it's disappointing, but we would understand that it simply cannot be done. Basically, it feels like we're being pacified with the impression that our opinions matter, when nothing is really being done to take high-demand requests seriously (much like with the bug reports).

I'm not trying to hijack the thread with feature requests, but to give an example of how Syabas can better engage the community to drive the product forward. If you are interested in discussing this or other key feature requests, I recommend taking a few minutes to review the highly-viewed and voted feature requests and spend some time with the community there. As someone who works with product management/marketing in the software industry, I know that many PM's fail to engage their use base enough. Doing this well oftentimes means all the difference between a successful release (with the support of the customer base) and failed release (without).

Please vote for Native Resolution/Framerate Sync support for the C200 - Option to disable PCH Upscaling - let your TV/AVR upscale here
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03-30-2011, 07:05 AM
Post: #82
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
(03-30-2011 06:43 AM)deh2k7 Wrote:  I would also like to add that it's important to look at feature requests that have a lot of the user's attention. Bug fixes are top priority of course, but the whole reason to have a platform such as the C-200 is extensibility.

We've been told to create feature requests and if they get enough support, they will get the attention of Syabas. Currently, these requests get little to no commentary from Syabas on whether they are feasible, likely to happen or otherwise. Like with the lack of QA comments on MANTIS, this engenders a sense of apathy from the community.

I'm very pleased, however, to see a good dialog in this thread, and would encourage Syabas to participate more regularly in the feature requests section.

A good example is this thread, which has more responses to the poll than any other feature request:
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showth...?tid=42667

It revolves around native resolution output (automatically) of video files - vs. specifying a fixed resolution output all of the time. Many users have scalers that are superior to what is in the C200, especially for SD material. This is also related to at least one MANTIS report on poor SD upscaling quality. This is a capability found in many consumer video source devices - it's very much an important feature for us. Many of us would consider this a core usability/functionality that should be in the product already. Even a basic ability to allow resolution switching on the fly while video is playing would be an improvement. Other than a couple vague comments from Werner, there has been no dialog or discussion with the community. Perhaps its feasible. Perhaps it's a limitation of the Sigma SDK or chip itself. Information would be good - if it's a limitation, it's disappointing, but we would understand that it simply cannot be done. Basically, it feels like we're being pacified with the impression that our opinions matter, when nothing is really being done to take high-demand requests seriously (much like with the bug reports).

I'm not trying to hijack the thread with feature requests, but to give an example of how Syabas can better engage the community to drive the product forward. If you are interested in discussing this or other key feature requests, I recommend taking a few minutes to review the highly-viewed and voted feature requests and spend some time with the community there. As someone who works with product management/marketing in the software industry, I know that many PM's fail to engage their use base enough. Doing this well oftentimes means all the difference between a successful release (with the support of the customer base) and failed release (without).

Totally agree with you Smile

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03-30-2011, 08:22 AM
Post: #83
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
deh2k7,

That "native" resolution request been on our TODO list for quite a while,
unfortunately it is one of those items on the backburner.

Let me prod engineering again on this item.

Sales: sales@syabas.com
Tech support: support@syabas.com
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03-30-2011, 08:44 AM (This post was last modified: 03-30-2011 08:48 AM by chris57.)
Post: #84
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
Stop the personal Want Lists please guys. Please wait for the List to be produced.

A400: SD Card(Apps), HDMI C200: USB(Apps), BD ROM (SH-B083L(SB01)), HDMI
CAT6 Wired Network: TV Panasonic TX-P42G20, HP ProCurve 1400-8G, Netgear GS-608/605, Synology CS407
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03-30-2011, 11:06 AM
Post: #85
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
I am not writing a personal wish list, but i believe that during the next 2 FWs, 2 main things must be done before slowing down development:

1. Fixing absolutely critical bugs
2. Developing absent features that are marketed in the C-200 like deep color support, etc....

Syabas can not slow down development before developing the features they are marketing/promising their customers on the already bought C-200, this would be not appropriate!

My 2 cents.

Hady

C-200 ---- Onkyo TX-SR606 ---- LG LCD LH42LH70YR
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03-30-2011, 11:24 AM
Post: #86
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
(03-30-2011 11:06 AM)hadyhosny Wrote:  I am not writing a personal wish list, but i believe that during the next 2 FWs, 2 main things must be done before slowing down development:

1. Fixing absolutely critical bugs
2. Developing absent features that are marketed in the C-200 like deep color support, etc....

Syabas can not slow down development before developing the features they are marketing/promising their customers on the already bought C-200, this would be not appropriate!

My 2 cents.

Hady
and i would like to say that i appreciate the discussion with syabas, which is open and constructive

i agree with hadyhosny and deh2k7 post, which is not (at my understanding) a personnal want list, , but an example of a feature list , to take care of 2 lists - bugs and features before slowing development of 200 series



chris57 you are talking about a List to be produced, who is in charge of that list (Syabas ?) if so , do that list and priority embelded features as mentionned in the posts above
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03-31-2011, 03:51 AM
Post: #87
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
hi guys! will i be able to notice the difference of the 3D MKV if i play it on my a210 compared to my a110? because i tried playing the same file on both player and so far i didn't see much difference when it comes to 3D..or am i doing it wrong? thanks!
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03-31-2011, 05:12 AM
Post: #88
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
(03-31-2011 03:51 AM)ert Wrote:  hi guys! will i be able to notice the difference of the 3D MKV if i play it on my a210 compared to my a110? because i tried playing the same file on both player and so far i didn't see much difference when it comes to 3D..or am i doing it wrong? thanks!

Nothing different viewing wise. the difference is the A210 will handle the stereo flag inside the mkv container signaling the tv to switch to 3d mode.
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03-31-2011, 10:26 AM
Post: #89
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
(03-31-2011 05:12 AM)halfelite Wrote:  
(03-31-2011 03:51 AM)ert Wrote:  hi guys! will i be able to notice the difference of the 3D MKV if i play it on my a210 compared to my a110? because i tried playing the same file on both player and so far i didn't see much difference when it comes to 3D..or am i doing it wrong? thanks!

Nothing different viewing wise. the difference is the A210 will handle the stereo flag inside the mkv container signaling the tv to switch to 3d mode.

ohh i see..so that's the only difference? it will just signal the TV to switch to 3D Mode automatically?
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03-31-2011, 11:04 AM
Post: #90
RE: Syabas is first to support MKV3D
(03-31-2011 10:26 AM)ert Wrote:  
(03-31-2011 05:12 AM)halfelite Wrote:  
(03-31-2011 03:51 AM)ert Wrote:  hi guys! will i be able to notice the difference of the 3D MKV if i play it on my a210 compared to my a110? because i tried playing the same file on both player and so far i didn't see much difference when it comes to 3D..or am i doing it wrong? thanks!

Nothing different viewing wise. the difference is the A210 will handle the stereo flag inside the mkv container signaling the tv to switch to 3d mode.

ohh i see..so that's the only difference? it will just signal the TV to switch to 3D Mode automatically?

You got it, the magic of marketing Big Grin

A400: SD Card(Apps), HDMI C200: USB(Apps), BD ROM (SH-B083L(SB01)), HDMI
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