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[NMJ v2] NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
01-05-2012, 09:00 AM
Post: #1
NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Hi All,

I'm at a point of just about giving up as I have spent almost a hundred hours of my free time on my Popcorn Hour and I'm starting to think it's just not worth it anymore.

I have both Macs and Windows PCs at home so I really don't care which tools I have to use, I just want something that works 99.95% of the time without me pulling my hair out.

This all started with me wanting to simply have a Jukebox view for my girlfriend. So here are my experiences.

YAMJ route:

I first tried the route of YAMJ, but of course there is the problem of the movie names not matching up so I then downloaded YANFOE to create the NFO files to the appropriate movie. While it does work, it's only for Windows and it's VERY buggy. I wish there was a MAC version, at this point I would gladly pay $100 to have a really nice MAC NFO movie manager!

I found that if I could get all of the images the way I wanted then the great folks that make TOMY have the second part of the equation down perfect as TOMY runs reasonably quickly and is bug free!

I eventually gave up on the route of YANFOE for making the NFO's to TOMY to YAMJ because the YANFOE program so then I figured that maybe the Popcorn Hour NMJ v2 would be the better route.

NMJ v2 route:

This hasn't worked out either because of the following:

1) The program just isn't finding all of my movies and it doesn't matter how many times I rescan.

2) When it does find my movies it's taking the year from the filename and thinking that is the name of the move, from 1977 to 2001, etc... to World Series games.

3) When I do fix the movie name and the correct artwork appears for some reason the artwork isn't updated on the main wall where all the movies appear. There is a workaround that the good folks in Customer Service made me aware of but it's a pain that requires copying files from the posters folder to the main folder.

It's supposed to be fixed at some point but my feeling is that major bugs should be fixed PRIOR to working on new things.

There is a level of trust that WE users and buyers place in a company to have things like the above working because while it's only a small amount of time for the company to fix these problems make it so that the problems associated with the product make our purchases seem not worth it and then we won't trust the company going forward.

I feel bad for saying what I'm saying at some level because I have had several conversations with the customer service guys at Popcorn Hour and they are GREAT guys. I think the issue has to do with whoever at the company sets priorities for fixing bugs versus working on new features. That person should really understand that there is a basic principle of fairness here.

I'm not blaming Popcorn Hour for anything associated with YAMJ as they have nothing to do with me wanting to have a nicer Jukebox but I really would like to have the BASIC Jukebox working without all of these headaches.

If a Mac was made like my NMJ Jukebox then I would only have access to 70% of the files on my HD and then the files would be misnamed Sad

So my question at this point is this:

Should I just upgrade to the new unit? Does it fix the above issues or am I setting myself up for another 2 years of frustrations about basic features or

Should I try using this NMJ Toolbox? Not that I should have to use this of course, but I guess if I can't get the basic NMJ to work then I have no choice, right?
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01-05-2012, 09:28 AM
Post: #2
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Why don't you try renaming your movies so that NMJ or YAMJ picks them up properly? Both state how they like movies to be named. If you are having an issue where neither picks them up, then you either have some very weird names or you use scene naming conventions which NO program is going to work 100% with.

10 minutes of using "the renamer" or similar would mean you need no NFO files. No NFO files, not YANFOE.

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01-05-2012, 10:27 AM (This post was last modified: 01-05-2012 10:29 AM by Ericvw.)
Post: #3
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Apart from renaming you could use "Ember revisited" (http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?t=90682). I use this program as my nfo-maker and it works reasonably good. I find renaming the best way to get Yamj to work but Ember helps in the process.
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01-05-2012, 10:34 AM
Post: #4
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
renaming files also hinders future subtitle referenses as they often come with specific names.
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01-06-2012, 02:39 AM
Post: #5
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Hi,

I actually HAVE renamed the files, using the EXACT names as on IMDB.com but I'm still having these 3 issues.

1) NMJ v2 is not seeing all of the files.

2) Some files are coming up with the wrong movie names, much of the time when there is more than one movie with the same name.

Sometimes the movie names that come up are movies with a year in the title or are worlds series games for a specific year.

3) When I do go in and fix those movies then the artwork isn't fixed on the wall which I'm told is a known bug for the past 2 1/2 years that hasn't been fixed and MAY be fixed in some future release.

I have ZERO problem in doing whatever I can to get this to work. I've put a hundred hours into working with YAMJ, YANFOE and TOMY then went back to working with Popcorn Hour's NMJ v2 hoping that I could get that working.

I'm not asking for much here. I just want the barebones basics, I don't need fancy stuff, just want a wall of movies with the cover images. I am willing to name the movies in ANY way that Popcorn Hour sees fit and I'd even be willing to look up the IMDB numbers if it helped and insert those in the files names!

With so many great people working on this why aren't the barebones basic bugs worked out?





(01-05-2012 09:28 AM)Omertron Wrote:  Why don't you try renaming your movies so that NMJ or YAMJ picks them up properly? Both state how they like movies to be named. If you are having an issue where neither picks them up, then you either have some very weird names or you use scene naming conventions which NO program is going to work 100% with.

10 minutes of using "the renamer" or similar would mean you need no NFO files. No NFO files, not YANFOE.
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01-06-2012, 03:11 AM
Post: #6
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
(01-06-2012 02:39 AM)robwired Wrote:  I actually HAVE renamed the files, using the EXACT names as on IMDB.com but I'm still having these 3 issues.

Naming conventions for YAMJ can be found here: http://code.google.com/p/moviejukebox/wiki/FileNaming

I don't know if NMJ uses the same but would have thought they'd be very similar.

(01-06-2012 02:39 AM)robwired Wrote:  1) NMJ v2 is not seeing all of the files.

By files do you mean your movie files or does this include artwork? If its just movies, again naming convention is probably the issue. If it's artwork, it needs to be exactly the same file name as per the movie.
Here is what YAMJ would look for when it comes to artwork file naming:
http://code.google.com/p/moviejukebox/wiki/Artwork

Sorry to keep quoting YAMJ but it's what I'm familiar with.

(01-06-2012 02:39 AM)robwired Wrote:  2) Some files are coming up with the wrong movie names, much of the time when there is more than one movie with the same name.

Sometimes the movie names that come up are movies with a year in the title or are worlds series games for a specific year.

Defo a file naming issue - see above.

(01-06-2012 02:39 AM)robwired Wrote:  3) When I do go in and fix those movies then the artwork isn't fixed on the wall which I'm told is a known bug for the past 2 1/2 years that hasn't been fixed and MAY be fixed in some future release.

You can't just rename the movie and not the artwork. They need to have the same name. It's not a bug, it's a requirement. I'm no coder but I suspect you'd be asking the code to do a huge amount of guess work otherwise.

(01-06-2012 02:39 AM)robwired Wrote:  I have ZERO problem in doing whatever I can to get this to work. I've put a hundred hours into working with YAMJ, YANFOE and TOMY then went back to working with Popcorn Hour's NMJ v2 hoping that I could get that working.

I know it's a chore as I've also spent hundreds of hours also just like most people who use these forums on a regular basis but personally I'd ditch NMJ, go back to YAMJ, get your file naming right. If you really want to manage your own artwork, NFOs etc, I'd use Ember over YANFOE just make sure you get the settings right.

(01-06-2012 02:39 AM)robwired Wrote:  I'm not asking for much here. I just want the barebones basics, I don't need fancy stuff, just want a wall of movies with the cover images. I am willing to name the movies in ANY way that Popcorn Hour sees fit and I'd even be willing to look up the IMDB numbers if it helped and insert those in the files names!

The last part can be done easily if you don't want to rename your movies to the correct conventions. Just create a NFO with exactly the same name as the movie file name and stick the imdb URL in it:
http://code.google.com/p/moviejukebox/wi...es#Example

(01-06-2012 02:39 AM)robwired Wrote:  With so many great people working on this why aren't the barebones basic bugs worked out?

Good question if you're referring purely to NMJ as I believe it was developed by the manufacturer and therefore potentially should be better supported, etc but seeing as I don't use it I can't really comment.

However YAMJ is pretty much one person (the underlying code not the skins) so will understandably not have the same support for something that is entirely FREE unless you care to donate or help:
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showth...?tid=57498
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01-06-2012, 03:29 PM
Post: #7
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Hi I know how you feel it may be a bug, I get same problem.
Quote:NMJ v2 route:

This hasn't worked out either because of the following:

1) The program just isn't finding all of my movies and it doesn't matter how many times I rescan.

2) When it does find my movies it's taking the year from the filename and thinking that is the name of the move, from 1977 to 2001, etc... to World Series games.
ie: Film 2010 nmj gives me baseball world series 2010. Rio (2011) gives me Rio (1939) The Mechanic (2011) gives me The Mechanic (1972) and so on. even when you go to manual update in nmj it finds Synopsis but leaves the old cover art. Help
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01-06-2012, 06:40 PM
Post: #8
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
(01-06-2012 03:29 PM)mv2002uk Wrote:  Hi I know how you feel it may be a bug, I get same problem.
Quote:NMJ v2 route:

This hasn't worked out either because of the following:

1) The program just isn't finding all of my movies and it doesn't matter how many times I rescan.

2) When it does find my movies it's taking the year from the filename and thinking that is the name of the move, from 1977 to 2001, etc... to World Series games.
ie: Film 2010 nmj gives me baseball world series 2010. Rio (2011) gives me Rio (1939) The Mechanic (2011) gives me The Mechanic (1972) and so on. even when you go to manual update in nmj it finds Synopsis but leaves the old cover art. Help

Same problem here with some World Series suddenly showing up on my wall and Rio that always points to the wrong one. Only difference is that I'm using a C200 which means it's the same problem on NMJ v1. This tells me a bit that it's not specifically the NMJ itself but something else that's involved in the update of this type of data (Syabas uses a proxy I believe to cache data?). Unless it's a coding error that's present in both versions.

Regarding the following:
Quote:3) When I do fix the movie name and the correct artwork appears for some reason the artwork isn't updated on the main wall where all the movies appear. There is a workaround that the good folks in Customer Service made me aware of but it's a pain that requires copying files from the posters folder to the main folder.
Could you give me that workaround please? I'm interested in it as I'm suffering from the same problem (although on the NMJ v1).
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01-06-2012, 06:57 PM (This post was last modified: 01-06-2012 07:05 PM by Auggie.)
Post: #9
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
(01-05-2012 09:00 AM)robwired Wrote:  I first tried the route of YAMJ, but of course there is the problem of the movie names not matching up so I then downloaded YANFOE to create the NFO files to the appropriate movie. While it does work, it's only for Windows and it's VERY buggy. I wish there was a MAC version, at this point I would gladly pay $100 to have a really nice MAC NFO movie manager!

I found that if I could get all of the images the way I wanted then the great folks that make TOMY have the second part of the equation down perfect as TOMY runs reasonably quickly and is bug free!

Although the TOMY TWO point OH will have a new NFO editor, it's not an NFO manager per se in that it doesn't do movie metadata downloads itself but relies on YAMJ to do the downloads. Meaning, you should still follow minimum video file naming conventions (e.g. "The Greatest Movie (1984).mkv", "Friends.S01E01E02.avi") in order for YAMJ to match as closely as possible the intended video/TV show. This usually gets me 99% of the videos correctly identified and metadata downloaded. For the remaining 1%, I manually lookup the IMDB ID and plug that into an NFO file then rerun YAMJ. Problem solved.

[Image: v20aJukeboxInspectorArtwork.png]

[Image: v20aVideoInspector.png]

With the filtering and column display options that will be available, this will hopefully help the user locate mis-identified or unidentified videos.
[Image: v20aJukeboxInspectorFiltering.png]


I'm trying to get it released no later than February (late February perhaps), but there seems to be a lot left to build even though so much has been done already...

TOMY: The Only Mac YAMJ GUI, now for Windows too! Both available here.
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01-06-2012, 10:26 PM (This post was last modified: 01-06-2012 10:51 PM by robwired.)
Post: #10
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Hi,

Outside of YAMJ development, TOMY is pretty much the only product I trust at this point. Everything else is really in Alpha testing mode or in various states of abandonment or requires me to create subdirectories for each file name, which can be done with various tools, but isn't really something I want to do.

I'm really happy to hear that you are progressing on TOMY development and incorporating some of what the media managers do. I'm not so much interested in a ton of fan art or any of that, I just want the bare minimums.

Regarding what you said after appropriately naming files, "For the remaining 1%, I manually lookup the IMDB ID and plug that into an NFO file then rerun YAMJ. Problem solved."

This would be completely fine! I was pretty much doing this within YANFOE, but that program is sooo buggy that I had to give up. I really had high hopes for it and the v2 of it looked so nice but it was so unstable and was just taking so long.

Having said all of this, I'm still really upset at the makers of Popcorn Hour for not fixing the bugs within NMJ that cause me to have to go through all of this trouble. Maybe I'll start a poll asking people if Popcorn Hour should fix those bugs Wink




(01-06-2012 06:57 PM)Auggie Wrote:  
(01-05-2012 09:00 AM)robwired Wrote:  I first tried the route of YAMJ, but of course there is the problem of the movie names not matching up so I then downloaded YANFOE to create the NFO files to the appropriate movie. While it does work, it's only for Windows and it's VERY buggy. I wish there was a MAC version, at this point I would gladly pay $100 to have a really nice MAC NFO movie manager!

I found that if I could get all of the images the way I wanted then the great folks that make TOMY have the second part of the equation down perfect as TOMY runs reasonably quickly and is bug free!

Although the TOMY TWO point OH will have a new NFO editor, it's not an NFO manager per se in that it doesn't do movie metadata downloads itself but relies on YAMJ to do the downloads. Meaning, you should still follow minimum video file naming conventions (e.g. "The Greatest Movie (1984).mkv", "Friends.S01E01E02.avi") in order for YAMJ to match as closely as possible the intended video/TV show. This usually gets me 99% of the videos correctly identified and metadata downloaded. For the remaining 1%, I manually lookup the IMDB ID and plug that into an NFO file then rerun YAMJ. Problem solved.

[Image: v20aJukeboxInspectorArtwork.png]

[Image: v20aVideoInspector.png]

With the filtering and column display options that will be available, this will hopefully help the user locate mis-identified or unidentified videos.
[Image: v20aJukeboxInspectorFiltering.png]


I'm trying to get it released no later than February (late February perhaps), but there seems to be a lot left to build even though so much has been done already...


Looking through the threads it looks like people keep bringing this up.

Could we maybe get a response from the developers on this???




(01-06-2012 06:40 PM)Swen Wrote:  
(01-06-2012 03:29 PM)mv2002uk Wrote:  Hi I know how you feel it may be a bug, I get same problem.
Quote:NMJ v2 route:

This hasn't worked out either because of the following:

1) The program just isn't finding all of my movies and it doesn't matter how many times I rescan.

2) When it does find my movies it's taking the year from the filename and thinking that is the name of the move, from 1977 to 2001, etc... to World Series games.
ie: Film 2010 nmj gives me baseball world series 2010. Rio (2011) gives me Rio (1939) The Mechanic (2011) gives me The Mechanic (1972) and so on. even when you go to manual update in nmj it finds Synopsis but leaves the old cover art. Help

Same problem here with some World Series suddenly showing up on my wall and Rio that always points to the wrong one. Only difference is that I'm using a C200 which means it's the same problem on NMJ v1. This tells me a bit that it's not specifically the NMJ itself but something else that's involved in the update of this type of data (Syabas uses a proxy I believe to cache data?). Unless it's a coding error that's present in both versions.

Regarding the following:
Quote:3) When I do fix the movie name and the correct artwork appears for some reason the artwork isn't updated on the main wall where all the movies appear. There is a workaround that the good folks in Customer Service made me aware of but it's a pain that requires copying files from the posters folder to the main folder.
Could you give me that workaround please? I'm interested in it as I'm suffering from the same problem (although on the NMJ v1).
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01-07-2012, 08:12 AM
Post: #11
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Regarding Tomy 2.0, looking at the picture you uploaded and your comments it looks like there will be a field for the IMDB ID#. Does that mean that if I plug the ID# in there then re-run it and YAMJ that I'll end up with the corrected media name and consequently the proper artwork, etc...?

With regards to NMJ, I finally figured out why I wasn't seeing all of the files. I downloaded NMJ Toolbox and figured out from its interface that because NMJ was naming so many media files incorrectly that I now had those misnamed files lumped together as episodes of each other rather than as separate movies. So under NMJ I could have gone to Episodes and my missing media files were there all along!

Ugh, NMJ Toolbox is somewhat helpful, but it is still in Beta and there is sooo much work that has to be done due to NMJ being soooo buggy.

If the developers just fixed the few problems that the users were complaining about then we wouldn't have to go in and manually fix anything!

Does anyone know if NMJ v2 will allow the use of .nfo files or is there some way to tell it manually which IMDB entry is correct without having to use a 3rd party tool?

For now, I have to do the following:

1) Locate the file that NMJ sloppily mislabeled.
2) Find that file in NMJ Toolbox.
3) Look up the IMDB TT #.
4) Enter that Number into NMJ Toolbox and update.
5) Go to NMJ on Popcorn Hour, find the mislabeled movie and update.
6) Go back to NMJ Toolbox, refresh, cross my fingers and if it didn't update appropriately, repeat step 5 till it does.
7) Go into NMJ Toolbox, manually update the artwork then update again.
8) Go to NMJ on Popcorn Hour, find the mislabeled movie and update.
9) Go back to NMJ Toolbox, refresh, cross my fingers and if it didn't update appropriately, repeat step 5 till it does.

On top of all of that, I have to go through each Show # to find duplicates because that is where I see if media files have been duplicated as episodes because they are hidden on the NMJ wall!!!!

All of this is making me really sad! There has got to be a better way to use NMJ or some way to get the developers to fix the known bugs.

Do you think we can shame them into fixing the bugs? What else would work?
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01-07-2012, 08:39 AM
Post: #12
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Everyone has to clean up their media files for their first jukebox. Your going all out and for me, it's the hard way.

grab yourself therenamer and concentrate on the filenames. That's where detection of your media starts.

Then use the common formats of:
Movie name (year).ext
TV Show (year).s##e##.ext

movie name and year to use comes from http://www.imdb.com
tv show name and IF it should have a year and what year comes from http://www.thetvdb.com (use the search reasults to know if it should have a year). there's a lot of tv show name overlap so this is important. s## is the season # and e## is the episode number, you can get them from thetvdb also.

therenamer searches thetvdb and imdb for you.

just having the correct filenames will fix 99.9% of your problems with detection.
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01-07-2012, 03:56 PM
Post: #13
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
(01-07-2012 08:12 AM)robwired Wrote:  Regarding Tomy 2.0, looking at the picture you uploaded and your comments it looks like there will be a field for the IMDB ID#. Does that mean that if I plug the ID# in there then re-run it and YAMJ that I'll end up with the corrected media name and consequently the proper artwork, etc...?

So long as the ID you plug into that field in the upcoming 2.0 is valid, then yes, this will instruct YAMJ to download the metadata specifically for that ID and ignore the video/file name.

What I also tend to do is to put all "new" (to me) video's first into a "pre-processing" folder and run YAMJ on that. This allows for a very quick indexing and I can easily make changes and corrections as necessary (specific IMDB ID if necessary, but more often than not, different artwork). Once I'm satisfied with all the new video's details, I then move these video's into "general population" (my "production" library) and run YAMJ on the whole library. I have roughly 1,800 videos and it can take quite a long time to run YAMJ against that, especially if its time for rechecks. In addition, due to the scanning and "caching" nature of OS X with folders, accessing a YAMJ jukebox via wired GigE SMB that contains tens of thousands of files can be unbearably slow (attempting to open my primary jukebox folder located on a NAS onto the Mac desktop to view it's contents can take upwards of half an hour or more before OS X finally displays it; NFS takes at least a tenth of the time over SMB under OS X... FYI, since TOMY 2.0 will now allow the user to directly manipulate contents of the jukebox folder, some of the file operations may take an agonizingly long time to complete under OS X, unfortunately).

Regarding NMJ v2, I don't know if the tonmjdb tool will convert a YAMJ jukebox to version 2 of NMJ, nor if the third-party NFO2NMJ will do so as well. As the 300 series and newer currently do not allow "html" style jukeboxes, if demand and means exist, I may contemplate adding a YAMJ-to-NMJv2 conversion utility. But YAMJ/Eversion appears to be the way to go IMO for the 300-series as an alternative to NMJ.

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01-12-2012, 04:36 PM
Post: #14
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
Problem with renaming the filenames, is that it is very hard to find subtitles later for the release of your movie.
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01-13-2012, 10:22 AM (This post was last modified: 01-13-2012 11:09 AM by Swen.)
Post: #15
RE: NMJ, YANFOE, YAMJ, Feel like giving up this HOBBY.
(01-12-2012 04:36 PM)MustAccord Wrote:  Problem with renaming the filenames, is that it is very hard to find subtitles later for the release of your movie.

not necessarily, there are subtitle websites which allow you to look up a subtitle based on the filesize of the moviefile, no matter what it's filename is.
You also have tools for Windows where you right-click on a moviefile and get options to download the subtitle for that movie. Opensubtitles has such a feature (http://www.opensubtitles.net/en/movie-su...archer.kif ) and there's also a tool called 'Periscope' (http://code.google.com/p/periscope/ ) which can do this (requires installation of Python though).

The nice thing about Periscope is that you can give it a priority for languages (in my case, first dutch and if those are not available, look for english subtitles, ...) and it will look at multiple subtitle websites at the same time. When it finds the subtitle, it will download it and put it directly at the same level as the moviefile with the same name (but with .srt extension). Another nice feature is that you can run Periscope on your whole movie folder (and subfolders) to look for any moviefiles where no subtitles are currently available and he will try to download them.

Sometimes you still get wrong subtitles (less then 1 percent gives me a wrong movie subtitle), sometimes you still get a wrong sync in the subtitle but in those cases, you would probably also run into the same problem if you are searching manually based on original filename.
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