C-300 BD ISO Menus and Playback

[moonracer]

I just purchased an A-300 and found that some of my BD ISO's won't play at all. Some BD ISO's work fine like Lord of the Rings will play and I can access the menus. King Kong and others will only play if I turn off Full Menu support and other won't play at all regardless. I understand that some movies will have some quirks and may not work at all; no problem and completely understandable.

Legend on the other hand played the menu one time and worked but now I only get the Universal logo and can't get any further. So it's a hit or miss for some strange reason.

My question is; for the most part, if I rip my BD's to ISO using AnyDVD and remove BD-Live and encryption will I be able to play most movies with full menu support on the C-300?

I don't have a need to play the discs themselves but like to play the BD ISO's from my NAS. I'm wondering if selling my A-300 for a C-300 will give me better results.

Regards,
moonracer

[chris57]

Having the benefit of a Bluray license does may backups play better and I have on my C200 used a backup to access the likes of BDLive without a problem.

You would simply have to create a 1:1 copy. So no removal of encryption or region protection is required. That helps as other than AACS there are other protection methods in bluray. There are from memory at least 6 well known ones plus Sony discs have structural protection and I'm sure that there will be others to come.
That's why AnyDVD keeps updating with such frequency.

Nothing will be 100%. There is always a reliance on chip manufacturers code for example, disc playback code for the c300 from Sigma does not work yet. Backups are fine but actual discs are not there yet.

In the A300 thread you refer to there is a post from a C300 or C200 owner saying he can play one of the backups that wont play on the A300.

[moonracer]

(01-16-2012 06:42 PM)chris57 Wrote:  Having the benefit of a Bluray license does may backups play better and I have on my C200 used a backup to access the likes of BDLive without a problem.

You would simply have to create a 1:1 copy. So no removal of encryption or region protection is required. That helps as other than AACS there are other protection methods in bluray. There are from memory at least 6 well known ones plus Sony discs have structural protection and I'm sure that there will be others to come.
That's why AnyDVD keeps updating with such frequency.

Nothing will be 100%. There is always a reliance on chip manufacturers code for example, disc playback code for the c300 from Sigma does not work yet. Backups are fine but actual discs are not there yet.

In the A300 thread you refer to there is a post from a C300 or C200 owner saying he can play one of the backups that wont play on the A300.

Thanks for the reply Chris. I'm not sure what to think at this point. I'm going to do some more testing on my end. I saw the post today about a bug in in NMJ Wall view when trying to view BD ISO's that prevents movies from playing. I'm just trying to get a better handle on this situation. I went with the Popcorn based on the features list on the Popcorn website and it sounded to me like Blu-ray ISO menus worked. I wasn't expecting all movies to work obviously.

If I'm going to get better results from a C-300 then I'll go that route.

I'll do more testing on my end then go from there. Maybe someone out there has tried both the A-300 and C-300 and can give me some more info regarding BD ISO's.

Thanks again Chris. You've been very helpful.

moonracer

[Willem53]

an ISO file structure can be created to be too complex for an media player to unravel in memory, in that case the file and menu structure can paralyze a mediaplayer if processing and memory capacity is insufficient.

try to extract the BD to folder structure and see if it plays like that.

[moonracer]

(01-16-2012 08:32 PM)Willem53 Wrote:  an ISO file structure can be created to be too complex for an media player to unravel in memory, in that case the file and menu structure can paralyze a mediaplayer if processing and memory capacity is insufficient.

try to extract the BD to folder structure and see if it plays like that.

Excellent point Willem! In fact, I have a copy of Legend with the folder structure intact transferring over to my NAS as I write this.

Thanks for the tip and I'l report back what I find.

Regards,
mr

[chris57]

And remember just because someone yells bug doesnt make it true, especially with a small sample size.

And you should always test outside of a jukebox any file that you have problems with. Plus the those that were reported as failing earlier were tested outside of NMJ as well. So although I would love it to be that simple it is not going to be IMO.

[moonracer]

(01-16-2012 10:23 PM)chris57 Wrote:  And remember just because someone yells bug doesnt make it true, especially with a small sample size.

And you should always test outside of a jukebox any file that you have problems with. Plus the those that were reported as failing earlier were tested outside of NMJ as well. So although I would love it to be that simple it is not going to be IMO.

I follow you Chris and I agree. I'm testing outside of any jukebox app and browsing folders instead.

Legend works amazingly well in BD file structure format instead of ISO. It starts up quickly and the FULL menus are easily accessible and snappy! Willem was correct in that BD ISO's must consume all available resources which prevents the movie/menus from displaying.

I'm also going to only test movies I have ripped myself ( 1:1) and not downloaded content to be sure the encryption has been removed and BD-Live is disabled. My goal is to get Full menu support, not Live, etc.

It would be nice to have a list ( if there isn't one already ) with BD 1:1 movies that are not working with Full menus on the A300.

I tried Bad Boys and American Gangster which I did not rip myself and they will not work. BB shows a status bar and when it completes the screen remains black. AG displays the Universal logo then shows a menu to select the language but once I select English; screen goes black and no go. I'm not going to linger on these two titles but test with fresh titles I've ripped.

Thanks and I will report back later once I've had a chance to rip more BD's, xfer them to my nas and test them on my A300.

[chris57]

Now we are going off track and back into A300 land.

There's no problem keeping a list of actual disc backups that do or do not display the original retail menu. Remember that there's a difference between Full Navigation (original menu or interactive menu) and display of the original menu and that discussion is one that we do not want rehashing as the position has been made abundantly clear and now finally confirmed.

I have a Universal rip of mine and I know what you mean about being able to select a language etc. and then it stalling, I also know about the logo and then it stopping. What I dont know is what version of AnyDVD-HD I used and what options I selected whilst backing up. Actually a confirmed list of settings for AnyDVD would be good for best compatibility with playback of original menu.

There's the problem of the multitude of releases for each movie. They do differ considerably. Also later releases in say trilogy packs may have updated protection whilst original releases do not. It's a big task to keep something current and relevant for all.

Right no more A300 as this is a C300 thread, anymore and I'll split off the A300 posts which may be the best idea in any case. We'll see I'm letting ti go presently as you are the original thread owner so its your thread. Perhaps a thread title change to something like 'Orignal Menu display' or similar?

[tyrindor]

Honestly the only way to get 100% working ISOs with the popcorn hour is to remove menus and just leave the main movie on there. I have over 800 movies with the menus/extras removed, still in ISO format, and they all play flawlessly. IMO, The A300 will never play 100% of the menus, the same goes for the C300. There will always be a good 10% of movies that won't play on any setting because of how complex they are. Not very many people want menus/extras, and with some movies they take up more space than the movie itself... the majority of people just remove them or just uses MKVs.

I was in your boat when I first got my C200, I wanted full menu playback.. but honestly even if it worked 100% of the time, it's still annoying and takes up tons of space. You have to wait through tons of warnings/trailers (many BDs don't even let you skip), then deal with a menu system that may be badly designed, then press play and wait through even more warnings. On some discs this is well over 5-10 minutes before you actually are watching the movie. I much prefer just removing all that now. When I want to watch a movie.. I press enter and it instantly plays the movie. No worrying about if the movie defaults to dolby digital instead of lossless, no worrying about if the movie has an extended version or regular version, etc. I choose what I want to keep, and what I don't when I remove the menus/extras.. so it automatically plays the best solution.

I'd also like to add... my average movie size was 37GB with menus/extras intact, after removing them my average movie size was 23GB. With only 800 movies thats 11.2TB of space saved. I have 51TB and it's full right now, so unless you have a ton of money or are not planning on having many BDs, leaving the menus/extras intact is going to cost a fortune. I really suggest just removing them.. unless they really are worth that much to you.

[moonracer]

Taking a step back from all of this; you are both right. I got carried away and lost focus. 100% Bluray playback / 1:1 is not realistic for anything out there at this point in time.

I'm going to enjoy those few movies that I find myself watching several times a year and try to get those working with menus but if not; I'll split the multiple versions into two separate movies ( theatrical vs directors cut ). Still beats fumbling with a bunch of discs and I have a nice, snappy interface to go along with it.

You can close this thread. I'm going to concentrate on getting my collection cleaned up and looking into the other features the a300 has to offer.

Cheers,
mr

[Willem53]

good thread on ISO payback... thanks all

[moonracer]

(01-17-2012 04:12 AM)tyrindor Wrote:  Honestly the only way to get 100% working ISOs with the popcorn hour is to remove menus and just leave the main movie on there. I have over 800 movies with the menus/extras removed, still in ISO format, and they all play flawlessly. IMO, The A300 will never play 100% of the menus, the same goes for the C300. There will always be a good 10% of movies that won't play on any setting because of how complex they are. Not very many people want menus/extras, and with some movies they take up more space than the movie itself... the majority of people just remove them or just uses MKVs.

I was in your boat when I first got my C200, I wanted full menu playback.. but honestly even if it worked 100% of the time, it's still annoying and takes up tons of space. You have to wait through tons of warnings/trailers (many BDs don't even let you skip), then deal with a menu system that may be badly designed, then press play and wait through even more warnings. On some discs this is well over 5-10 minutes before you actually are watching the movie. I much prefer just removing all that now. When I want to watch a movie.. I press enter and it instantly plays the movie. No worrying about if the movie defaults to dolby digital instead of lossless, no worrying about if the movie has an extended version or regular version, etc. I choose what I want to keep, and what I don't when I remove the menus/extras.. so it automatically plays the best solution.

I'd also like to add... my average movie size was 37GB with menus/extras intact, after removing them my average movie size was 23GB. With only 800 movies thats 11.2TB of space saved. I have 51TB and it's full right now, so unless you have a ton of money or are not planning on having many BDs, leaving the menus/extras intact is going to cost a fortune. I really suggest just removing them.. unless they really are worth that much to you.

Tryindor,
I did some research and ended up buying a player that has played every BD ISO with full menus that I have thrown at it. The Netgear NeoTV 550. Not one title has failed to play on that device. For $115 on Amazon; i found it to be worth the money and I use it for all of my BD ISO needs. The A300 is far superior in terms of movie thumb scraping, stability with the UI and overall features but at least I can now view my small number of favorites in BD ISO format with full menus.

I thought I'd share my findings with you.

Regards,
mr

[pepar]

(01-17-2012 04:38 AM)moonracer Wrote:  Taking a step back from all of this; you are both right. I got carried away and lost focus. 100% Bluray playback / 1:1 is not realistic for anything out there at this point in time.

I'm going to enjoy those few movies that I find myself watching several times a year and try to get those working with menus but if not; I'll split the multiple versions into two separate movies ( theatrical vs directors cut ). Still beats fumbling with a bunch of discs and I have a nice, snappy interface to go along with it.

You can close this thread. I'm going to concentrate on getting my collection cleaned up and looking into the other features the a300 has to offer.

Cheers,
mr

(02-03-2012 01:47 AM)moonracer Wrote:  Tryindor,
I did some research and ended up buying a player that has played every BD ISO with full menus that I have thrown at it. The Netgear NeoTV 550. Not one title has failed to play on that device. For $115 on Amazon; i found it to be worth the money and I use it for all of my BD ISO needs. The A300 is far superior in terms of movie thumb scraping, stability with the UI and overall features but at least I can now view my small number of favorites in BD ISO format with full menus.

I thought I'd share my findings with you.

Regards,
mr

moonracer, what happened to "losing focus, 1:1 is not realistic for anything out there and getting your collection cleaned up?"

Jeff

[moonracer]

(02-07-2012 12:56 AM)pepar Wrote:  

(01-17-2012 04:38 AM)moonracer Wrote:  Taking a step back from all of this; you are both right. I got carried away and lost focus. 100% Bluray playback / 1:1 is not realistic for anything out there at this point in time.

I'm going to enjoy those few movies that I find myself watching several times a year and try to get those working with menus but if not; I'll split the multiple versions into two separate movies ( theatrical vs directors cut ). Still beats fumbling with a bunch of discs and I have a nice, snappy interface to go along with it.

You can close this thread. I'm going to concentrate on getting my collection cleaned up and looking into the other features the a300 has to offer.

Cheers,
mr

(02-03-2012 01:47 AM)moonracer Wrote:  Tryindor,
I did some research and ended up buying a player that has played every BD ISO with full menus that I have thrown at it. The Netgear NeoTV 550. Not one title has failed to play on that device. For $115 on Amazon; i found it to be worth the money and I use it for all of my BD ISO needs. The A300 is far superior in terms of movie thumb scraping, stability with the UI and overall features but at least I can now view my small number of favorites in BD ISO format with full menus.

I thought I'd share my findings with you.

Regards,
mr

moonracer, what happened to "losing focus, 1:1 is not realistic for anything out there and getting your collection cleaned up?"

Jeff

Pepar,
The more I thought about it, the more annoyed I got that full menu support was so close yet not fully there. I also agreed at the time of that post that my chances were slim to find a player that would support full BD menus. I was wrong! The 550 was so cheap I took a chance and was very surprised at how well it could handle full menus. It's interface is quite lacking, buggy and lacks a lot of features in all honesty.

My fault for misreading the features list of the a-300 on the PCH website and making too many assumptions.

Instead of crying about it, I'll keep plugging away to get what I want and I'm happy.

Ripping my entire collection of BD's to full ISO's is not feasible but I do enjoy accessing the extra content of my favorite movies.

Cheers,
mr

[pepar]

(02-07-2012 04:54 AM)moonracer Wrote:  Ripping my entire collection of BD's to full ISO's is not feasible but I do enjoy accessing the extra content of my favorite movies.

Cheers,
mr

Gotcha! My process will be - A-300 will ship 15 Feb! - rip to folder structure with main movie, lossless audio and, if needed, subtitles. For the rare occasions that I want to watch an extra, I will pull the physical disc and play it. For me anyway, the extras just don't hold any attraction. Saving server space does though.

Jeff